Relative Strength

[shadowspider33]

Damn well that's too bad

[hwillish]

Very interesting topic and very interesting threads lately.  Although I never had the opportunity to meet Cindy H. as she has been truly retired for several years, I have seen Yasmin a couple of times recently and both ladies are always at the top of the all time "mention" list when it comes to relative strength.  As for Yasmin, she loves her "anacondas" and knows how to use them...enough said.

Another impressive "girl next door" is Julie Squeeze who is really not in the same class as these two, but still will give one a good "tumble".  And Veve Lane is "strong as hell" as well.

As to the more 'well known" bodybuilder ladies, I have also had the chance to meet many of them and honestly, I have come away somewhat disappointed...especially the larger ladies who I thought would be much stronger than they were.  Without mentioning any names, it does really seem to me that size (juiced or not) does not necessarily translate into strength. 

But, you still gotta love em...lol.

   

[zig563]

Weight strength in terms of what you can lift is seperate from knowing how to use it. That means leverage, proper technique, and lots of other things. All things being equal....size does matter. Trust me on that. Watch an NFL or NCAA football game and the guys up front. They all weight over 300 for a reason. Not one guy ever plays who's 250 and has that super sneaky strength or leverage. The height matter too up front. Long arms beat short arms if things are equal again. I have some experience with this stuff. I was only a 340 bench guy in college who passed on roids. Most guys were way over 400 and many over 500+. I could handle alot of the 500+ guys almost  single time b/c I had longer arms, better feet, and knew how to maximize every bit of my strength.

Wrestling is technique and knowing the things I just mentioned. The girls you guys are talking about are good athletes. Some girls could lift much more, but really were not athletes. Others were. Andrea Trent and Gina Davis come to my mind as athletes. I'll leave the list of non athletes alone.

[FemFlexUSA]

Cindy and I went to a health club together and I observed her curl 60 pound dumbbells - yes, dumbbells -  multiple times with good form.  She is very strong.  Of course, she is probably in the top 1% of the top 1% of women, but she is proof that a sexy woman can be very strong.

I concur.  She is freakishly strong for a woman her size.  It was surprising to the point of 'unbelievable'.  I hope she chooses to make a comeback someday.

It's so funny when some guy says all men can beat all women.  Of course there are many women who are stronger or better fighters than many men.  Here is my guess.   While "strength" or "fighting skill" depends on how you measure it, I would propose that there is a bell curve for men and a bell curve for women, and that men are on average stronger, maybe largely because they are bigger.  In any case here is my guess.  I would guess that the average woman is stronger than the weakest 5% of men, and 5% of strongest women are stronger than the average man.  What do you think?

I haven't really tried to quantify what you're saying, but your estimates seem reasonable.  I probably talk about it too much myself, but I've always been amazed by how many pull-ups strong women can do compared to strong guys.  Even in CrossFit, the guys do not completely dominate the women in this upper-body exercise.

[wolf5]

Weight strength in terms of what you can lift is seperate from knowing how to use it. That means leverage, proper technique, and lots of other things. All things being equal....size does matter. Trust me on that. Watch an NFL or NCAA football game and the guys up front. They all weight over 300 for a reason. Not one guy ever plays who's 250 and has that super sneaky strength or leverage. The height matter too up front. Long arms beat short arms if things are equal again. I have some experience with this stuff. I was only a 340 bench guy in college who passed on roids. Most guys were way over 400 and many over 500+. I could handle alot of the 500+ guys almost  single time b/c I had longer arms, better feet, and knew how to maximize every bit of my strength.

Wrestling is technique and knowing the things I just mentioned. The girls you guys are talking about are good athletes. Some girls could lift much more, but really were not athletes. Others were. Andrea Trent and Gina Davis come to my mind as athletes. I'll leave the list of non athletes alone.

What about the girls who arent really good wrestlers but are just reall strong that can be hard to take when wrestling like a jana or amber steel

[LuvBigChix]

Weight strength in terms of what you can lift is seperate from knowing how to use it. That means leverage, proper technique, and lots of other things. All things being equal....size does matter. Trust me on that. Watch an NFL or NCAA football game and the guys up front. They all weight over 300 for a reason. Not one guy ever plays who's 250 and has that super sneaky strength or leverage.

Ladies and gentlemen, Fred Dean, Hall of Fame pass rusher, 230 pounds at peak weight, well known for not just his quickness and speed, but unusual strength going against left tackles as 280 to 300-pounders became more common.

Want more modern? Pro Bowl pass rusher Cameron Wake lists at 258, which puts him under 250 by October.

[Pinme]

Getting us back on topic, I will note that there are three types of women I like.   1). Women who are stronger than me.   2). Woman who can outwrestle me.  3). Women who are stronger than me and also can outwrestle me.  There are session women out there in all three categories.   I am especially enamoured with good looking normal sized women in Category 3.   Veve and Jolie come to mind. 

[MixedWrestler]

I can agree with wolf5. I wrestled Jana, and she turned out to be freakishly strong! Not much technique, and she officially does only semi-comp. But even when I tried to fight back, once she had me in whatever grip, it was game over for me.

And another thing about relative strength. Somewhere on youtube there is a video of " sport science" , where Lucia Rijker proves to hit twice as hard as a pro boxer who is almost double her size. It turnes out she has a much better technique than this guy.

[wolf5]

Exactly Mixedwrestler Jana wrestles with know technique just pure strength, and there wasnt to much u could do. So if a persons really strong, n u jus have technique u can beat them I dont believe that

[dothedammthing]

Wrestling is a strength sport. As the difference in raw strength of the wrestlers increase, the technique factor has a diminishing effect. This is why wrestling competitions are divided into weight classes. Even if you're the world's greatest wrestler in the world, you won't stand a chance against an fbb like Jana if you're a skinny 120 pound guy.

[zig563]

Fred Dean and Cameron don't play on 1st down vs the run. Get it? Of course, speed can get around power. Speed beats power in a pass rush situation. Dean was a 3rd down only guy if you recall, though very good at what he did which was rush the passer. You obviously don't know much about football. Tell me how many OL are in the NFL that are under 300 pounds right now? That is 250 plus players. Of course defenders are a bit smaller outside of the middle b/c they have to cover people in the schemes used nowadays. Guys like Cameron cover people in certain schemes.  Clueless guy who must use google for his life's info. 258 is really small....eh? Neither one of those guys is Reggie White. Dean was on the right team at the right time. Niners were good. He woud not play in today's game as a hand down DE.

Leverage wins. Did you ever think why Dean was watching from the side on 1st down often and called a "3rd down specialist?" He was too small and got run over vs the run. That is why he's not an all time great. If he was 270, then he would have been. 230 then is like 260 now, so the modern comparasion is about right. I doubt Cameron  sniffs greatness. Schemes my man...schemes. Learn of what you speak.

[zig563]

120 would not beat 170 very often. A very skilled 120....if you ever watch those classes are usually all based in quickness +technique. There is a reason for the weight class. Someone the same weight as whatever Jana is would likely beat her if they have an athletic bone in their body. You can see that she and most session fbbs are pretty unskilled. I've never been interested in that sort of thing b/c I know it would disappoint me. Perhaps a roll with some of the best looking ladies in a fun sense, but why pay? I  get it tho. It fufills a fetish. There are bigger fish to fry than session wrestlers or even the worlds oldest profession.

Wrestling is much more about technique than it is about strength. I had a buddy who went to the olympics in wrestling greco roman, though he was great in high school and college (scholarship of course). He was in the 170 class and his natural weight was about 195. He used to get killed in football. He was only skilled in wrestling. Could not hit a ball, catch a ball, or handle a block from a guy much bigger. He did make a few tackles in high school, but was only decent vs the run.

[wolf5]

I see what you guys are saying but sometimes strength can out match the weight/wrestling technique. Ive read on this forum some dude was 6'4 220lb and Jana still completely dominated him. Im like 190-200lb and play sports and I couldnt get her off me at all when she pinned me.

[dothedammthing]

120 would not beat 170 very often. A very skilled 120....if you ever watch those classes are usually all based in quickness +technique. There is a reason for the weight class. Someone the same weight as whatever Jana is would likely beat her if they have an athletic bone in their body. You can see that she and most session fbbs are pretty unskilled. I've never been interested in that sort of thing b/c I know it would disappoint me. Perhaps a roll with some of the best looking ladies in a fun sense, but why pay? I  get it tho. It fufills a fetish. There are bigger fish to fry than session wrestlers or even the worlds oldest profession.

Wrestling is much more about technique than it is about strength. I had a buddy who went to the olympics in wrestling greco roman, though he was great in high school and college (scholarship of course). He was in the 170 class and his natural weight was about 195. He used to get killed in football. He was only skilled in wrestling. Could not hit a ball, catch a ball, or handle a block from a guy much bigger. He did make a few tackles in high school, but was only decent vs the run.

In boxing, a skinny 120 pound with "quickness and technique" can take down many big guys. Fetish wrestling is a completely different ballgame. If the guys complain about fbb's not being "skilled" enough, they need to go to the local gym and find people who take wrestling as seriously as they do. You wouldn't ask a lawyer to fix your car, and vice versa. It's the same idea here. Yes, wrestling is much more about technique  that it is about strength IN THE SAME/SIMILAR WEIGHT CLASS.. not when you're wrestling someone who has 80 pounds on you. This is jut common sense folks.

[zig563]

They have weight classes in boxing for a reason too. Mike Tyson would have killed Ray Leonard...who was pretty skilled. I get the gist of what you are saying, but 120 doesn't beat 170 often in boxing unless 170 has never boxed. That is why we have rape in society...other than mentally ill people. Men are bigger and stronger than women in general. They pick on they can prey on usually. Same with kids. You don't see adult men being raped by gays, but you see it with little boys.

I agree with the last fellas on session wrestling. I've never done it, but met many fbbs who do and most of them tell you they stink at wrestling. It is a fantasy thing like stated. The male isn't supposed to try if he's better. ...or what would be the point?  To beat up a session wrestler and say you won?