Forum Saradas
Private Sessions => Warnings for Private Sessions & Scammers and Complaints => Topic started by: terpsfan7777 on March 04, 2014, 03:02:30 pm
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Dear Friends and Fans of Penpraghai,
I would like to solicit your support with respect to her recent unfair treatment on this forum. My apologies for the long post, but this needs to be addressed.
To j635746 and femwrest,
I understand your frustration. To recap - and please correct me if I am wrong - your argument proceeds as follows:
1) You were in contact with Fon (or someone using Fon's name) to set up a session (j635746) and a Skype appt. (femwrest).
2) The session / Skype appt. never transpired and despite repeated attempts, your deposits were never returned. Fon is aware of this, and you feel like you are getting shafted (and rightfully so I might add).
3) You have speculated and in j635746's case, accused Fon of being a scam artist. J635746, not only have you repeated this statement on
threads about Fon, but you have posted it on other threads not even related to her (Rene Toney and Figure Power as two examples). Your reasons are as follows:
A) Jennifer Thomas received similar complaints, emailed Fon, never received a response, and removed her profile from Sessiongirls, in which Fon has yet to defend herself.
B) Fon has not returned your deposit, nor has she honored your session.
C) Fon has yet to defend herself on this Forum, despite other stories of impropriety surfacing.
I know Fon personally and I would like to respond with all due respect:
1) Fon has been betrayed by someone close to her and this individual is using her name to scam people, the details of the situation is a personal matter in which Fon kindly asks for her friends' and fans' to respect her privacy on. This individual is not a serial scam artist, nor an evil human being, just someone who is hurting and who's passion and emotion is clouding this person's better judgement.
2) I personally agree that the right thing for Fon to do is to return your deposits despite being a victim herself. If she is having financial issues, then I will offer to donate some money to help her rectify the situation.
3) That said, in my opinion, this does not give you, or anyone else the right to defame her character by accusing her of being a scam artist with only circumstantial evidence to back you up. J635746, I have read all of your posts in connection with this matter and I feel justified in stating that your focus has been on accusing Fon of being a scam artist, as opposed to what you can prove, which is the fact that she has not returned your deposit (that was taken from you by someone else but using her name). You come across as being vindictive and as much as you have a right to be upset, in my view you have no right to attempt to destroy her reputation given the facts at hand. We are all human and none of us are perfect.
There is an ENORMOUS difference between unfairly not returning your deposit in a case where she is also a victim, and her being a scam artist (one is a disagreement about right and wrong / or a financial inability to make things right, the other is an intentional and malicious case of fraud). I can't overstate this difference enough and the potentially disastrous effects the latter could have on her reputation - and quite unfairly and tragically so.
4) My response to the circumstantial evidence surrounding this matter is as follows:
A) The Thai culture is vastly different from western cultures (right or wrong - I am not here to debate, just pointing out a fact) - Thai's are very non-confrontational in nature and it is not unusual for a Thai person to remain silent in such circumstances, even if they are hurting inside.
B) It's possible that Fon never received Jennifer's email with respect to Sessiongirls given that she changed her email address; and even if Fon is aware of this attempted correspondence, she may be retired from sessions and may no longer wish to be represented on that website; and again, her Thai upbringing may be influencing her not to respond.
C) It may be cultural influences driving Fon's absence on this forum and non responsiveness to emails relating to this topic; and again, given that her email address has changed, she may not have ever received many of the correspondences in connection with this issue.
D) Please look at Fon's extensive and unblemished track record before being too quick to judge. Over the last 3-4 years, Fon has honored possibly over 500 Skype and session deposits, so it makes no sense that she would suddenly just start scamming people out of the blue.
E) For those of you who have sessioned / Skyped with Fon, you know that she is warm and friendly and genuinely enjoys her time with you - I ask you, what could she possibly have to gain by scamming people out of nowhere - and it just doesn't match up with her personality - wouldn't you agree?
In conclusion, I cannot prove or disprove the truth as I live in the U.S. and was not with Fon, and I understand your frustration concerning your unreturned deposits and I feel that you are justified in your position; but I vehemently disagree with your repeated accusations of framing Fon as a scam artist and defaming her name; it is absolutely deplorable behavior in my opinion.
So j635746, I respectfully ask you to remove the posts in which you are framing Fon as a scam artist and / or retract this accusation (and feel free to reach out to me privately, as perhaps I can broker an arrangement in which you can get your deposit back....no promises, but I could try.....same with you femwrest).
To all Penpraghai friends and fans (if you agree with me here).....then I urge you to rally behind her and please respond on this thread and show her your support before her reputation is unfairly and permanently damaged. Also, please write to the moderator and request that the permanent locked post accusing her of scamming people be removed. Thirdly, please write to the various female muscle websites and tell them that they will receive your continued support and urge them to keep doing business with Fon. Lastly, please send Fon an email at penpraghaitiangngok@gmail.com to show her your support.
Thank you for reading this.
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lol
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Dear Friends and Fans of Penpraghai,
I would like to solicit your support with respect to her recent unfair treatment on this forum. My apologies for the long post, but this needs to be addressed.
To j635746 and femwrest,
I understand your frustration. To recap - and please correct me if I am wrong - your argument proceeds as follows:
1) You were in contact with Fon (or someone using Fon's name) to set up a session (j635746) and a Skype appt. (femwrest).
2) The session / Skype appt. never transpired and despite repeated attempts, your deposits were never returned. Fon is aware of this, and you feel like you are getting shafted (and rightfully so I might add).
3) You have speculated and in j635746's case, accused Fon of being a scam artist. J635746, not only have you repeated this statement on
threads about Fon, but you have posted it on other threads not even related to her (Rene Toney and Figure Power as two examples). Your reasons are as follows:
A) Jennifer Thomas received similar complaints, emailed Fon, never received a response, and removed her profile from Sessiongirls, in which Fon has yet to defend herself.
B) Fon has not returned your deposit, nor has she honored your session.
C) Fon has yet to defend herself on this Forum, despite other stories of impropriety surfacing.
I know Fon personally and I would like to respond with all due respect:
1) Fon has been betrayed by someone close to her and this individual is using her name to scam people, the details of the situation is a personal matter in which Fon kindly asks for her friends' and fans' to respect her privacy on. This individual is not a serial scam artist, nor an evil human being, just someone who is hurting and who's passion and emotion is clouding this person's better judgement.
2) I personally agree that the right thing for Fon to do is to return your deposits despite being a victim herself. If she is having financial issues, then I will offer to donate some money to help her rectify the situation.
3) That said, in my opinion, this does not give you, or anyone else the right to defame her character by accusing her of being a scam artist with only circumstantial evidence to back you up. J635746, I have read all of your posts in connection with this matter and I feel justified in stating that your focus has been on accusing Fon of being a scam artist, as opposed to what you can prove, which is the fact that she has not returned your deposit (that was taken from you by someone else but using her name). You come across as being vindictive and as much as you have a right to be upset, in my view you have no right to attempt to destroy her reputation given the facts at hand. We are all human and none of us are perfect.
There is an ENORMOUS difference between unfairly not returning your deposit in a case where she is also a victim, and her being a scam artist (one is a disagreement about right and wrong / or a financial inability to make things right, the other is an intentional and malicious case of fraud). I can't overstate this difference enough and the potentially disastrous effects the latter could have on her reputation - and quite unfairly and tragically so.
4) My response to the circumstantial evidence surrounding this matter is as follows:
A) The Thai culture is vastly different from western cultures (right or wrong - I am not here to debate, just pointing out a fact) - Thai's are very non-confrontational in nature and it is not unusual for a Thai person to remain silent in such circumstances, even if they are hurting inside.
B) It's possible that Fon never received Jennifer's email with respect to Sessiongirls given that she changed her email address; and even if Fon is aware of this attempted correspondence, she may be retired from sessions and may no longer wish to be represented on that website; and again, her Thai upbringing may be influencing her not to respond.
C) It may be cultural influences driving Fon's absence on this forum and non responsiveness to emails relating to this topic; and again, given that her email address has changed, she may not have ever received many of the correspondences in connection with this issue.
D) Please look at Fon's extensive and unblemished track record before being too quick to judge. Over the last 3-4 years, Fon has honored possibly over 500 Skype and session deposits, so it makes no sense that she would suddenly just start scamming people out of the blue.
E) For those of you who have sessioned / Skyped with Fon, you know that she is warm and friendly and genuinely enjoys her time with you - I ask you, what could she possibly have to gain by scamming people out of nowhere - and it just doesn't match up with her personality - wouldn't you agree?
In conclusion, I cannot prove or disprove the truth as I live in the U.S. and was not with Fon, and I understand your frustration concerning your unreturned deposits and I feel that you are justified in your position; but I vehemently disagree with your repeated accusations of framing Fon as a scam artist and defaming her name; it is absolutely deplorable behavior in my opinion.
So j635746, I respectfully ask you to remove the posts in which you are framing Fon as a scam artist and / or retract this accusation (and feel free to reach out to me privately, as perhaps I can broker an arrangement in which you can get your deposit back....no promises, but I could try.....same with you femwrest).
To all Penpraghai friends and fans (if you agree with me here).....then I urge you to rally behind her and please respond on this thread and show her your support before her reputation is unfairly and permanently damaged. Also, please write to the moderator and request that the permanent locked post accusing her of scamming people be removed. Thirdly, please write to the various female muscle websites and tell them that they will receive your continued support and urge them to keep doing business with Fon. Lastly, please send Fon an email at penpraghaitiangngok@gmail.com to show her your support.
Thank you for reading this.
Firstly I did post that Fon did contact me via PM on her to let me know what had happened be it some a month later. When I challenged her regarding her ex-manager taking booking and scamming people and asked her what she intended to do, she simply did not reply.
If she was genuinely sorry about the whole thing, she could have named the ex-manager but chose not to. While I did not book a Skype session, she could have offered that. But nothing. Of course she wants to say sorry and draw a line under it as it's bad for business. Maybe she believes that if we are willing to spend a lot of money to have a session with her, that we can just right off a $200 deposit. I'm afraid that it is the principal here.
I actually think that women who offer sessions, let their manager or boyfriend handle all the emails and admin should honest about it upfront.
I don't know if you post is based on an opinion or you know her well.
As for sessiongirls and Jennifer Thomas. As you say, Fon may not have received the emails but ultimately she is selling sessions under her name and not her manger or ex-manager's name so buck stops with her to coin a phrase.
I'm afraid that the post stands until she does the right thing. I've attempted to contact her as I said and she has chosen to disregard the email.
I will happily amend my post if she does the right thing.
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First Post!
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NO sense in arguing withj635746. He doesn't have it in him to let anything go or admit he's wrong. He argues with women he doesn't ever plan to see about their session rates for the sake of arguing, for pity's sake.
His obsession with being out of pocket by bringing it up at any opportunity is concerning an amount that represents probably about 0.01 per cent of the amount he's spent on sessions. Most of us have bad experiences and chalk it up to experience. We don't make it a vendetta lasting however many months he's been posting on the one topic.
It's interesting that for all he's told us about it, it took the defence of Fon for an admission that she had contacted him. He posts selectively like that.
Is Fon guiltier than Oscar Pistorius? The jury is still out, but I like anyone who posts a passionate rebuttal of someone else when it goes against the tide as terpsfan has done.
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So someone from a non-confrontational culture takes up wrestling sessions that are based upon confrontation... ???
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Most of us have bad experiences and chalk it up to experience. We don't make it a vendetta lasting however many months he's been posting on the one topic.
Allow me to respectfully disagree with your statement. This is a business involving a lot of money, for the sessionnists and for us. Trust is primordial. If anyone, wrestler or client, behaves in an irrespectful way, he or she deserves such vendetta.
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Anyone else notice that this was the poster's first post! Seems a little to suspicious to me.
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Most of us have bad experiences and chalk it up to experience. We don't make it a vendetta lasting however many months he's been posting on the one topic.
Allow me to respectfully disagree with your statement. This is a business involving a lot of money, for the sessionnists and for us. Trust is primordial. If anyone, wrestler or client, behaves in an irrespectful way, he or she deserves such vendetta.
Unfortunately Polite Society sets out his stall on this. He seems to think that it's no big deal if a deposit or two goes astray and the session is not honoured. As he offers UTR services, I would expect him to be somewhat biased in this area.
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Anyone else notice that this was the poster's first post! Seems a little to suspicious to me.
Could simply be someone who has been a viewer on this board and decided to speak up for Penpraghai because they feel that the comments are unfair.
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Chip101 - yes first post haha, I wish under different circumstances, I will introduce myself momentarily.
Hanso - yes you are correct haha, but here, I am using the word non-confrontational in more of a social sense as opposed to a physical one.
Polite - thank you for your support, I appreciate it.
j635746 - thank you for responding, this is not personal and I apologize if it appears as such. I don't disagree with your points, but I am not sure if my point is being understood here.
To clarify,
What we know is that Fon has to date elected not to return j635746's (and others) deposit(s). There is nothing else that can be proved. j635746 thinks that he is owed his deposit back and Fon presumably thinks that the individual who is fraudulently taking his money is the one who should be returning his deposit.... not her.... (please don't lose sight of the fact that she is a victim here too).
To address the situation, Fon has changed all of her bank accounts, passwords, her email address and Facebook page; and she has posted a message on her Facebook page warning people of the situation - so that no one else gets hurt in the future. She has not, however, chosen to compensate anyone who has already been impacted.
With the above information in mind, for people to say that this is unfair to j635746 is defendable.
But to call her a scam artist based on this information alone is a stretch at best, and at worst, downright malicious. Also, labeling her as a scam artist based on the circumstantial evidence summarized in my previous post is quite frankly unfair (not to mention that I also presented circumstantial evidence that would refute this assertion - such as the fact that over the last 3-4 years she has honored possibly over 500 deposits with not a single complaint)....and the word scam artist (or something similar) is not buried just once or twice in these threads, it is used repeatedly in multiple threads, and there is even a permanent locked post with similar words tattooed to the subject line.
The difference between asserting that this is unfair to j635746 and calling Fon a scam artist is analogous to a slap on the wrist vs. being crushed over the head with a sledge hammer.
She is a real human being with feelings, and she has a good heart, I know her well enough to confidently make that statement on a public forum. Try to imagine people making such a statement about you, over and over again for months on a forum like this, read by thousands of people across the world - it probably wouldn't feel too good.
I urge anyone who thinks that she should return his deposit to write to her and tell her that. But I also urge everyone to write to her to show her your support, and tell her that it's unfair for her to be labeled as a scam artist. I respectfully ask posters to go easy on the scam artist accusations, and to ask the moderator to remove these words from her name until there is a smoking gun that proves otherwise. Lastly, j635746, my offer still stands, feel free to reach out to me privately and I would be happy to at least try to help you get your deposit back.
My name is Dave, I live in the U.S., and I think that muscle on a woman is sexy. Although I am a newly registered member to the community - I have been reading this forum for a long time, and I want to thank all of you for your informative posts, it's a really great community, and thank you for letting me be a part of it.
I hope this clarifies the point - from my vantage point with all due respect - it is entirely fair that you may disagree with Fon's decision to not send j635746 money or some form of compensation to remedy his lost deposit, but it is unfair and tragic to characterize her as a scam artist. She is getting crushed here and it is very sad. She is a good person. If you agree with me, please support her.
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Sorry guys - couldn't resist posting here to say I've fallen off my seat laughing at this new line of topical discussion.
I've been in business now for 14 years - if I did what has been alleged, I'd be out of business - irrespective of culture. There's a simple line of restitution to be taken - does Fon have the balls to step up to the mark? I'd like to think so as she's got one hell of a fit bod that needs exploration. However...
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Most of us have bad experiences and chalk it up to experience. We don't make it a vendetta lasting however many months he's been posting on the one topic.
Allow me to respectfully disagree with your statement. This is a business involving a lot of money, for the sessionnists and for us. Trust is primordial. If anyone, wrestler or client, behaves in an irrespectful way, he or she deserves such vendetta.
Unfortunately Polite Society sets out his stall on this. He seems to think that it's no big deal if a deposit or two goes astray and the session is not honoured. As he offers UTR services, I would expect him to be somewhat biased in this area.
As always, I have your entire modus operandi pegged. As always applies - if you can't afford to lose it, don't spend it. :shhh:
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Terpsfan I have to hand it to you as you must really like to type and pontificate. I think she would be better served by returning the ill gained funds than by sending you out as her mouthpiece. If she returned a dollar for every word you have written she probably would have repaid everyone who was scammed of their funds.
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Most of us have bad experiences and chalk it up to experience. We don't make it a vendetta lasting however many months he's been posting on the one topic.
Allow me to respectfully disagree with your statement. This is a business involving a lot of money, for the sessionnists and for us. Trust is primordial. If anyone, wrestler or client, behaves in an irrespectful way, he or she deserves such vendetta.
Unfortunately Polite Society sets out his stall on this. He seems to think that it's no big deal if a deposit or two goes astray and the session is not honoured. As he offers UTR services, I would expect him to be somewhat biased in this area.
As always, I have your entire modus operandi pegged. As always applies - if you can't afford to lose it, don't spend it. :shhh:
And there you have it folks. Polite Society has just made a great point for not agreeing to pay a deposit, especially where high sums of money are concerned or even offering one.
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Chip101 - yes first post haha, I wish under different circumstances, I will introduce myself momentarily.
Hanso - yes you are correct haha, but here, I am using the word non-confrontational in more of a social sense as opposed to a physical one.
Polite - thank you for your support, I appreciate it.
j635746 - thank you for responding, this is not personal and I apologize if it appears as such. I don't disagree with your points, but I am not sure if my point is being understood here.
To clarify,
What we know is that Fon has to date elected not to return j635746's (and others) deposit(s). There is nothing else that can be proved. j635746 thinks that he is owed his deposit back and Fon presumably thinks that the individual who is fraudulently taking his money is the one who should be returning his deposit.... not her.... (please don't lose sight of the fact that she is a victim here too).
To address the situation, Fon has changed all of her bank accounts, passwords, her email address and Facebook page; and she has posted a message on her Facebook page warning people of the situation - so that no one else gets hurt in the future. She has not, however, chosen to compensate anyone who has already been impacted.
With the above information in mind, for people to say that this is unfair to j635746 is defendable.
But to call her a scam artist based on this information alone is a stretch at best, and at worst, downright malicious. Also, labeling her as a scam artist based on the circumstantial evidence summarized in my previous post is quite frankly unfair (not to mention that I also presented circumstantial evidence that would refute this assertion - such as the fact that over the last 3-4 years she has honored possibly over 500 deposits with not a single complaint)....and the word scam artist (or something similar) is not buried just once or twice in these threads, it is used repeatedly in multiple threads, and there is even a permanent locked post with similar words tattooed to the subject line.
The difference between asserting that this is unfair to j635746 and calling Fon a scam artist is analogous to a slap on the wrist vs. being crushed over the head with a sledge hammer.
She is a real human being with feelings, and she has a good heart, I know her well enough to confidently make that statement on a public forum. Try to imagine people making such a statement about you, over and over again for months on a forum like this, read by thousands of people across the world - it probably wouldn't feel too good.
I urge anyone who thinks that she should return his deposit to write to her and tell her that. But I also urge everyone to write to her to show her your support, and tell her that it's unfair for her to be labeled as a scam artist. I respectfully ask posters to go easy on the scam artist accusations, and to ask the moderator to remove these words from her name until there is a smoking gun that proves otherwise. Lastly, j635746, my offer still stands, feel free to reach out to me privately and I would be happy to at least try to help you get your deposit back.
My name is Dave, I live in the U.S., and I think that muscle on a woman is sexy. Although I am a newly registered member to the community - I have been reading this forum for a long time, and I want to thank all of you for your informative posts, it's a really great community, and thank you for letting me be a part of it.
I hope this clarifies the point - from my vantage point with all due respect - it is entirely fair that you may disagree with Fon's decision to not send j635746 money or some form of compensation to remedy his lost deposit, but it is unfair and tragic to characterize her as a scam artist. She is getting crushed here and it is very sad. She is a good person. If you agree with me, please support her.
You speak as if you know her well. Or are you just making assumptions here.
Please see the PM I received at the end of December last year.
Hi This is Penpraghai. Very sorry, i just see this. It's not me, I have no control all my old accounts, it belong to my ex-manager, please don't send any money there. I set up new email penpraghaitiangngok@gmail.com i am making new facebook.
All she has done is send out a warning but has not claimed to be a victim in any way. Further more when I replied to the PM, she chose not to reply.
I still make that point that once her manager became her ex-manager, she had an obligation to close any accounts he controlled or change the passwords. If "PenpraghaiTiangngok" is truly her profile, she could have posted this warning people online. I find it too convenient that I received this PM only after I posted here about my experience with Fon.
Furthermore, if as Figure Power told me that Fon was going to retire from private sessions, she could have also had her profile removed from sessiongirls. And if the ex-manager controlled that account, she could have simply created a new email account and emailed Jennifer Thomas.
So I am afraid that as much as you make a good case for Fon being a victim, helpless to have prevented this. Until she is willing to provide some tangible evidence, my opinion of her as a scam artist still stands.
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Thank you J635746. I think we agree on everything except for your last statement.
Given that for some, my penchant for pontification and typing may have clouded the message as opposed to making it more clear, I will try to use fewer words this time.
Scam = fraud, Fon did nothing fraudulent, therefore, Fon is not a scam artist and any posts claiming such should be eliminated. That said, people who lost their deposits deserve to get them back.
I can't argue with the fairness issue as pointed out by J635746 and others, or the business issue as pointed out by sharkymarky, with respect for her reluctance to compensate those impacted, but this viewpoint is well documented. What has not been well documented is the other side of the story. In addition, the evidence to support the case for fraud on her part is quite limited at best.
I can understand how her handling of the sessiongirls issue could lead some to at least become suspicious of possible fraud. Although your point is logical J635746, her culture is very different when it comes to dealing with such matters and she has a long track record of honoring deposits.
Perhaps I am biased by my own culture in the U.S. where someone is innocent until proven guilty, but I just feel like she has been treated as guilty until proven innocent in connection with the scam artist label, which is unfair in my view. I publicly vouch for her as someone who would not commit fraud.
J635736, as long as you understand my points, if you still disagree then I have no choice but to accept that. My ask is for people who do agree with me, however, to show her some form of support, even if not on a public forum like this, and for people to go easy on the scam artist label until / unless there is a smoking gun. I hope that all of you who lost deposits get them back and I hope, just like sharkymarky, that this matter gets appropriately resolved.
Thank you again.
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Those of us who have been scammed by session women to some degree are familiar with the excuses that the women give.
One of the reasons that I and others will post a bad experience on such a forum to to make sure that other men are informed. They will judge Fon and decide if she is a scammer or not.
This reminds of a TV show in the UK called Rogue Traders. Where, the team go undercover to expose shoddy practices of trading firms. They scam people, disappear and then set up a new company where they are free to continue with the scam.
You claim that Fon is a victim and we should all support her. What proof have you offered? A new email, Facebook and PayPal account and a statement on there is hardly proof that she is a victim and innocent.
I can understand why you think we should all support Fon. If the story is true, then there are a lot of who have been bitten. This of course is bad for business. I have already made it clear to any site administrator that I will not subscribe to any members website that employs Fon as one of their models.
If she wants to be believed, then she should come on here and back up her claims that she is a victim and offer proof. A name and picture of the ex-manager/boyfriend would be a start.
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Dear Friends and Fans of Penpraghai,
I would like to solicit your support with respect to her recent unfair treatment on this forum. My apologies for the long post, but this needs to be addressed.
To j635746 and femwrest,
I understand your frustration. To recap - and please correct me if I am wrong - your argument proceeds as follows:
1) You were in contact with Fon (or someone using Fon's name) to set up a session (j635746) and a Skype appt. (femwrest).
2) The session / Skype appt. never transpired and despite repeated attempts, your deposits were never returned. Fon is aware of this, and you feel like you are getting shafted (and rightfully so I might add).
3) You have speculated and in j635746's case, accused Fon of being a scam artist. J635746, not only have you repeated this statement on
threads about Fon, but you have posted it on other threads not even related to her (Rene Toney and Figure Power as two examples). Your reasons are as follows:
A) Jennifer Thomas received similar complaints, emailed Fon, never received a response, and removed her profile from Sessiongirls, in which Fon has yet to defend herself.
B) Fon has not returned your deposit, nor has she honored your session.
C) Fon has yet to defend herself on this Forum, despite other stories of impropriety surfacing.
I know Fon personally and I would like to respond with all due respect:
1) Fon has been betrayed by someone close to her and this individual is using her name to scam people, the details of the situation is a personal matter in which Fon kindly asks for her friends' and fans' to respect her privacy on. This individual is not a serial scam artist, nor an evil human being, just someone who is hurting and who's passion and emotion is clouding this person's better judgement.
2) I personally agree that the right thing for Fon to do is to return your deposits despite being a victim herself. If she is having financial issues, then I will offer to donate some money to help her rectify the situation.
3) That said, in my opinion, this does not give you, or anyone else the right to defame her character by accusing her of being a scam artist with only circumstantial evidence to back you up. J635746, I have read all of your posts in connection with this matter and I feel justified in stating that your focus has been on accusing Fon of being a scam artist, as opposed to what you can prove, which is the fact that she has not returned your deposit (that was taken from you by someone else but using her name). You come across as being vindictive and as much as you have a right to be upset, in my view you have no right to attempt to destroy her reputation given the facts at hand. We are all human and none of us are perfect.
There is an ENORMOUS difference between unfairly not returning your deposit in a case where she is also a victim, and her being a scam artist (one is a disagreement about right and wrong / or a financial inability to make things right, the other is an intentional and malicious case of fraud). I can't overstate this difference enough and the potentially disastrous effects the latter could have on her reputation - and quite unfairly and tragically so.
4) My response to the circumstantial evidence surrounding this matter is as follows:
A) The Thai culture is vastly different from western cultures (right or wrong - I am not here to debate, just pointing out a fact) - Thai's are very non-confrontational in nature and it is not unusual for a Thai person to remain silent in such circumstances, even if they are hurting inside.
B) It's possible that Fon never received Jennifer's email with respect to Sessiongirls given that she changed her email address; and even if Fon is aware of this attempted correspondence, she may be retired from sessions and may no longer wish to be represented on that website; and again, her Thai upbringing may be influencing her not to respond.
C) It may be cultural influences driving Fon's absence on this forum and non responsiveness to emails relating to this topic; and again, given that her email address has changed, she may not have ever received many of the correspondences in connection with this issue.
D) Please look at Fon's extensive and unblemished track record before being too quick to judge. Over the last 3-4 years, Fon has honored possibly over 500 Skype and session deposits, so it makes no sense that she would suddenly just start scamming people out of the blue.
E) For those of you who have sessioned / Skyped with Fon, you know that she is warm and friendly and genuinely enjoys her time with you - I ask you, what could she possibly have to gain by scamming people out of nowhere - and it just doesn't match up with her personality - wouldn't you agree?
In conclusion, I cannot prove or disprove the truth as I live in the U.S. and was not with Fon, and I understand your frustration concerning your unreturned deposits and I feel that you are justified in your position; but I vehemently disagree with your repeated accusations of framing Fon as a scam artist and defaming her name; it is absolutely deplorable behavior in my opinion.
So j635746, I respectfully ask you to remove the posts in which you are framing Fon as a scam artist and / or retract this accusation (and feel free to reach out to me privately, as perhaps I can broker an arrangement in which you can get your deposit back....no promises, but I could try.....same with you femwrest).
To all Penpraghai friends and fans (if you agree with me here).....then I urge you to rally behind her and please respond on this thread and show her your support before her reputation is unfairly and permanently damaged. Also, please write to the moderator and request that the permanent locked post accusing her of scamming people be removed. Thirdly, please write to the various female muscle websites and tell them that they will receive your continued support and urge them to keep doing business with Fon. Lastly, please send Fon an email at penpraghaitiangngok@gmail.com to show her your support.
Thank you for reading this.
Instead of asking people email to Ms.Penpraghai (how we will know this is her real email), why don't you just invite her to Saradas to make an explanation and finish this soap opera?
Ms.Penpraghai is familiar with Saradas, she is already a member here, I know before she was posting here regularly under one of her thread so it shouldn't be so difficult to come here and post an explanation.
Saradas is top notch and the biggest FBB discussion board on the net, moderators can verify her identity so we can believe her explanation.
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Instead of asking people email to Ms.Penpraghai (how we will know this is her real email), why don't you just invite her to Saradas to make an explanation and finish this soap opera?
Ms.Penpraghai is familiar with Saradas, she is already a member here, I know before she was posting here regularly under one of her thread so it shouldn't be so difficult to come here and post an explanation.
Saradas is top notch and the biggest FBB discussion board on the net, moderators can verify her identity so we can believe her explanation.
You've hit the nail on the head. As this appears to be terpsfan7777's first post here, he has read the previous posts and decided to take up the mantle and defend Fon. The reason has not become clear yet as his posts have attempted to be impartial with no hidden agenda.
You make the point that moderators can verify her identity but what else can they do? Her explanation could still be a pack of lies.
What she is effectively claiming is that she is a victim of identity theft. If it was a nameless individual, it might be believable. But the fact she says it's her ex-manager/ex-boyfriend makes it highly questionable.
Let's face it id any of us fell prey to id theft, our credit rating and standing would deminish until we sorted it out.
So if she has fallen prey to id theft, then quite rightly, her standing will and should suffer until she fixes the problem.
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Terpsfan since you just showed up with a singular agenda and seem to have no interest here except this one topic why do you think that we should give you any credibility or believe anything you have to say?
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Thank you Duke.
Yes, my primary purpose is to strongly support Penpraghai. As I see it there are two issues here - fraud and accountability. To be clear, I am posting to address the issue of fraud specifically.
Given that my acquaintance with Fon is a private matter and that I am new to the forum, I understand that my qualitative statements concerning Fon's good nature will likely be discounted. That is unfortunate, but entirely fair Duke.
The following statements, however, are either factual in nature or at least follow some form of logic - and as such, my credibility or lack thereof should be irrelevant here:
1) Fon has honored possibly over 500 deposits over the last 3-4 years.
2) Fon has generally been characterized as a warm and friendly individual by posters on this forum before this incident occurred.
3) There doesn't appear to be any logical motive for Fon to suddenly commit fraud.
4) "Crimes of passion" are well documented in human history so why wouldn't it be conceivable that an ex who was hurting could have made an error in judgement here?
5) The Thai culture is very non -confrontational.
6) Fon has posted a warning on her FB page concerning the matter.
7) After being crushed on this forum, it's entirely possible that Fon might be reluctant to post a defense here for fear of being crucified.
Members have the right to go back and read the posts and decide for themselves. I have read them all and quite frankly, I see no smoking gun, only weak circumstantial evidence in connection with fraud. Yet, she has been accused of fraud a countless number of times.
To me that is sad, especially given that I know her personally, because her reputation is at stake; and that's why I ask readers who agree with me to support her with respect to the fraud issue, even if privately.
This does not in any way detract from the empathy that is warranted for those impacted and the respect for those
who have made intelligent posts related to accountability - but again this is a different topic vs. the topic of fraud.
Fon is not a scam artist and any post indicating such should be removed until / unless there is a smoking gun in my humble opinion.
Thanks again.
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Terpsfan7777, as always you make a passionate case for Fon but does not really convince me here. Let's say hypothetically that you are correct. Let's look at the timeline:
1. I received a PM from profile penpraghaitiangngok after my initial post.
2. Fon could have warned people online here so that no one fell prey to this scam.
3. The new Facebook account for someone called Penpraghai Tiangngok was set up after my initial post. I don't think that FB accounts are verified so I have no reason to believe that it is genuine.
4. It was only after femwrest suggested to Fon that she should have warned people on her Facebook page that she did it.
5. She may have honoured deposits in the past but that is not necessarily an indicator. I had a session with a women twice where deposits where paid and honoured. But on the occasion when she cancelled, twice it took 6 months and the power of this forum to persuade her to return the deposit.
You claim that Fon is honest and decent. Well the first dishonest act is that she failed to mention that all communications in setting up a session are with her manager/boyfriend and not her directly. That does not sound very honest.
Next, you believe that we should not call her a scam artist or con artist until we have the smoking gun. This is not a court of law.
I am not looking for a confrontation with Fon, but she should be willing to engage with the people effected by this scam and come to some agreement. But that would he honest and decent thing to do.
So my conclusion that she is a scam artist still stands. And with regards to people supporting her, who is ready and willing to hand over $200 deposit for a private session or pay $100 in advance for a Skype session.
But she has a bad online reputation that will follow her around until she deals with it. I was quite interested when I did a Google search for "penpraghai tiangngok scam"
If you know her well, rather than posting well written posts, you might advise her to engage with the people who have been scammed.
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terpsfan7777, I've come to the conclusion that you are a shill, a tool and an apologist for people who rip off others.
Last November she ripped me off my $200 deposit after I received an unsolicited E-mail from her informing me she's in town and wanted to set up a session. I was one of the people who informed J.T. at Session Girls and she made an attempt to E-mail Fon to rectify the situation. When Fon didn't respond, J.T. took her profile off Session Girls.
Your post defending Fon is really pathetic. Even if her psycho boyfriend is responsible, she still has some control over the situation. The fact that she does not feel she should refund us says a lot about her.
Although she did not advertise on WB270, I E-mailed the owner of that site and his response to me was as pathetic as your post here.
The bottom line is we got ripped off i.e. victims of online crime, but all you sad people care about is her reputation. I'm willing to bet you could care less that none of us will get our money back.
I haven't done any sessions since and don't know if I will do so again after this incident, but one thing's certain. I'll never leave deposits for anybody again. If that rules out 90% of the ladies, so be it. I'm not eager to return anyway.
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I am not that much experienced (so far only 8 sessions with 6 different girls), and I was never asked for a deposit (well, maybe it is because I am not into FBBs, and I carefully choose the girls, picking only the ones that seem gueniely enjoy the sessions). I had great experience all the time so far.
But I am watching forums for the long time, and let me say some general thoughts about sessions deposits.
1) The girls request deposits to cover no-show loses and discourage time wasters. I understand that, and that's their right. On the other hand, they should consider this also their commitment. If the session is cancelled because of any other reasons than the client himself, they should return the deposit immediatelly, whether it was tornado, war, sudden personal loss or healt issues...To paraphrase Polite Society, if they can't afford to refund the deposits, they should not ask for them.
2) There are many stories about girls that do not behave like that. They cancel the session (or even worse, let the client travel to the location and do not show up), and do not return the fee, using various excuses or simply not communicating.
3) The only defense against this is to publicly talk about such behavior, and making sure it will not pass unnoticed. This should discourage the girls to do that (it may be tempting, they already have the money and if they know nothing bad happens when they just keep them...), and spread the word about real scammers more quickly.
4) That's also what j635746 did in this case, and it was fair. Including the fact he repeated it on various forums etc. It is also fair to state the full truth - for example to add the fact Fon contacted him, saying she was scammed by her ex-someone... but then stopped communicating again and making no effort to remedy what already happen. Which I think he did, too.
5) I think there should be no exceptions to this. We should not encourage scamming girls to find excuses that are acceptable by the community... by accepting no excuses.
6) Fon was asking deposits, even before the scam. Thus, point 1) should apply to her, and she should be aware it is a commitment. Either she takes responsibility for what happened (thus her ex-someone causes her mostly financial loss - he was basically stealing her money), or not (and then it is fair her reputation gets damaged). She apparently chose the second option. But then, it is not j635746 who is damaging her reputation, it was her ex-someone.
7) I do not know how much damage was done (neither how much of it could be prevented if she acted more quickly). But if she really honored over 500 deposits during the last years, then she should be able to afford to refund the deposits, if she wants to act fair and to save her reputation...
8 ) If she is in situation she can't afford it, she can at least appologize and communicate, and perhaps ask the guys if they understand and leave it alone. That's not confornational behaviour. Some may be rich or generous enough or to show compassion, some not. She cannot just assume the first one without asking. Btw: If she asks 50%, then one extra session she does would cover two scammed clients. I do not know how high is hourly wage of average man who does session, but I would guess it is significantly lower than $400 per hour.
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TL;DR summary - if the girl is asking deposits, she should take it as her commitment, making sure she can refund if anything bad happens on her side. And the community has full right to expose the ones who don't, by any means and intensity.
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RobRoy, thoughtful post, thanks for sharing. Leg Freak, by definition the term scam artist implies fraud and by definition fraud means intent to deceive.
Fon deceived no one, she simply feels that she has no liability because she didn't take anything from anyone. She also posted a warning on her FB page discrediting someone that she was very close to for a long time, which was not easy for her to do.
Probably 100 out of 100 readers on this forum will disagree on the liability issue and claim that she does owe restitution since her name was used in this fraud.
As stated several times, I am not disputing this point and I have empathy for those impacted. Also, this entire situation is clearly unfortunate for the session industry.
I am simply saying that Fon did not commit fraud and any statements claiming such is libel and should be amended - as there is an enormous difference between having a philosophical disagreement with respect to liability and defaming someone's character. Just like it is not fair to those who have been impacted, it is not fair to drag someone's reputation through the mud based on conjecture. The former view is well documented, but the latter is not.
If your level of respect for her is driven by the liability issue that's entirely fair, but I respectfully ask you not to unfairly associate that with intent to deceive.
Thank you again.
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RobRoy, thoughtful post, thanks for sharing. Leg Freak, by definition the term scam artist implies fraud and by definition fraud means intent to deceive.
Fon deceived no one, she simply feels that she has no liability because she didn't take anything from anyone. She also posted a warning on her FB page discrediting someone that she was very close to for a long time, which was not easy for her to do.
Probably 100 out of 100 readers on this forum will disagree on the liability issue and claim that she does owe restitution since her name was used in this fraud.
As stated several times, I am not disputing this point and I have empathy for those impacted. Also, this entire situation is clearly unfortunate for the session industry.
I am simply saying that Fon did not commit fraud and any statements claiming such is libel and should be amended - as there is an enormous difference between having a philosophical disagreement with respect to liability and defaming someone's character. Just like it is not fair to those who have been impacted, it is not fair to drag someone's reputation through the mud based on conjecture. The former view is well documented, but the latter is not.
If your level of respect for her is driven by the liability issue that's entirely fair, but I respectfully ask you not to unfairly associate that with intent to deceive.
Thank you again.
I disagree with this assessment here. You are saying that Fon is innocent and a victim. Once she went her own way with her ex-? she should have communicated this on this forum and on session girls where she was registered until this happened. If you believe her story, then by doing nothing, she aided her ex-??? in perpetrating this scam and is guilty.
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RobRoy, thoughtful post, thanks for sharing. Leg Freak, by definition the term scam artist implies fraud and by definition fraud means intent to deceive.
Fon deceived no one, she simply feels that she has no liability because she didn't take anything from anyone. She also posted a warning on her FB page discrediting someone that she was very close to for a long time, which was not easy for her to do.
Probably 100 out of 100 readers on this forum will disagree on the liability issue and claim that she does owe restitution since her name was used in this fraud.
As stated several times, I am not disputing this point and I have empathy for those impacted. Also, this entire situation is clearly unfortunate for the session industry.
I am simply saying that Fon did not commit fraud and any statements claiming such is libel and should be amended - as there is an enormous difference between having a philosophical disagreement with respect to liability and defaming someone's character. Just like it is not fair to those who have been impacted, it is not fair to drag someone's reputation through the mud based on conjecture. The former view is well documented, but the latter is not.
If your level of respect for her is driven by the liability issue that's entirely fair, but I respectfully ask you not to unfairly associate that with intent to deceive.
Thank you again.
You talk like an attorney, are you representing her? Are you an attorney? Are you making veiled threats to what we can say here? Why should our words here be tempered by what you "respectfully" ask us what to and what not to write?
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Do you even know any attorneys. Doesn't sound like one at all
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RobRoy, thoughtful post, thanks for sharing. Leg Freak, by definition the term scam artist implies fraud and by definition fraud means intent to deceive.
Fon deceived no one, she simply feels that she has no liability because she didn't take anything from anyone. She also posted a warning on her FB page discrediting someone that she was very close to for a long time, which was not easy for her to do.
Probably 100 out of 100 readers on this forum will disagree on the liability issue and claim that she does owe restitution since her name was used in this fraud.
As stated several times, I am not disputing this point and I have empathy for those impacted. Also, this entire situation is clearly unfortunate for the session industry.
I am simply saying that Fon did not commit fraud and any statements claiming such is libel and should be amended - as there is an enormous difference between having a philosophical disagreement with respect to liability and defaming someone's character. Just like it is not fair to those who have been impacted, it is not fair to drag someone's reputation through the mud based on conjecture. The former view is well documented, but the latter is not.
If your level of respect for her is driven by the liability issue that's entirely fair, but I respectfully ask you not to unfairly associate that with intent to deceive.
Thank you again.
She had two choices she could have contacted Jennifer Thomas back when Jennifer tried to contact her to clear things up and she could have contacted the WB270. You act like she has no clue how to do any of these things to defend herself. Not everyone on here goes to facebook to see this. I for one never seen this post and I follow her both on her page at the time and her fan page she had.
So with all due respect just shut the hell up and stop telling us what we should do and how we should forgive her. IF she expects that she should come to the board herself and talk with all of us. Not send her messenger boy to come tell us what she would like. IMHO the only thing she is doing it making her look more guilty for having her lackey come here and speak on her behalf. It also seems a little immature for you and her to be doing this. Drop the subject and go away. No one will change their views of her and what she did. She did this to herself, we did not do this to her. We did not defame her, she did that all on her own. She can blame her ex/manager, but the bottom line is she had the opportunity to let everyone know before hand.
End of subject and the last I will speak on this.
Thank you Leg Freak. My thoughts exactly.
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RobRoy, thoughtful post, thanks for sharing. Leg Freak, by definition the term scam artist implies fraud and by definition fraud means intent to deceive.
Fon deceived no one, she simply feels that she has no liability because she didn't take anything from anyone. She also posted a warning on her FB page discrediting someone that she was very close to for a long time, which was not easy for her to do.
Probably 100 out of 100 readers on this forum will disagree on the liability issue and claim that she does owe restitution since her name was used in this fraud.
As stated several times, I am not disputing this point and I have empathy for those impacted. Also, this entire situation is clearly unfortunate for the session industry.
I am simply saying that Fon did not commit fraud and any statements claiming such is libel and should be amended - as there is an enormous difference between having a philosophical disagreement with respect to liability and defaming someone's character. Just like it is not fair to those who have been impacted, it is not fair to drag someone's reputation through the mud based on conjecture. The former view is well documented, but the latter is not.
If your level of respect for her is driven by the liability issue that's entirely fair, but I respectfully ask you not to unfairly associate that with intent to deceive.
Thank you again.
You talk like an attorney, are you representing her? Are you an attorney? Are you making veiled threats to what we can say here? Why should our words here be tempered by what you "respectfully" ask us what to and what not to write?
He sure sounds like a control freak, doesn't he???
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Terpsfan might be the ex-manager coming on here in a weird kind of way.
Anyway, I hear Fon is getting ready to get back into wrestling and private sessions....any truth Terpsfan?
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just a thought, as with my business, not just sessions, but other business. to save face and keep your reputation in tack you must "suck it up" sometimes. if this was me, and no one controls my money, I would honor all sessions that were set up. ok, I make 1/2 the money, but I have my name and that is my reputation. I may not like it, but in the end, it would/should benefit my future business as well. I never read original posts and such, but reading this one, all of this could have been handled so much more professionally. good luck guys and happy sessioning!! ;)
:hey:
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If Fon truly had a desire to defend her reputation she should have come one here herself and stated so. She didn't do that because she cannot justify returning the money or not responding to Jen T's inquiries.
The very fact that this Terp person won't disclose the nature of his relationship with Fon negates any anrguments he makes. You need to know somone's perspective before you can evaluate their words.
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Does anyone know what happened to her?
She seemed to be all over a lot of the websites then suddenly disappeared. Is she still doing photo/video sessions for websites? Or even offering sessions for fans?
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saw her recently at hbc. a bit off-season, but still in decent shape. would love to do a wrestling session with her again, but only if she doesn't ask for a deposit. never ever would pay a deposit to her even i think the story with her boyfriend who ripped her off is true.
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Thanks for the update...didn't know she was still on HBC. Hopefully will catch her on there.
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Terpsfan I have to hand it to you as you must really like to type and pontificate. I think she would be better served by returning the ill gained funds than by sending you out as her mouthpiece. If she returned a dollar for every word you have written she probably would have repaid everyone who was scammed of their funds.
:laugh:
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I think I was actually the first to public her scam on Saradas almost one year ago, as I've waited for her to show up in my hotel room for an hour like an idiot. Still waiting for my deposit back...
Why would someone even care if it's really her or not? Ppl should only care about staying away from anything related to her since all of her contacts seems to lead to a scammer or a person who don't really care about providing the service he/she claims to do against the deposits he/she requests.
And I've read your arguments. I don't buy this ferry tales. I think she benefits quite good from naive guys like me and j#. But that's only my opinion here. At the bottom line, you should keep away that's for sure.
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I think I was actually the first to public her scam on Saradas almost one year ago, as I've waited for her to show up in my hotel room for an hour like an idiot. Still waiting for my deposit back...
Why would someone even care if it's really her or not? Ppl should only care about staying away from anything related to her since all of her contacts seems to lead to a scammer or a person who don't really care about providing the service he/she claims to do against the deposits he/she requests.
And I've read your arguments. I don't buy this ferry tales. I think she benefits quite good from naive guys like me and j#. But that's only my opinion here. At the bottom line, you should keep away that's for sure.
That's pretty much my attitude, I've seen her on HBC recently, probably because she can't get too many guys to Skype with her after ALL of this, but even on HBC where there is little possibility to get scammed .... I have NO desire to see her, which is a real real, but she did it to herself.
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I must have missed this thread somehow.
Like I said before, if Fon was really innocent, then why not just meet me for the Skype chat? I am not even asking for my money back. Well, that was one option, the other was simply to give me what I paid for.
Also, yes she posted the warning on her FB page but MUCH later. I had confronted her, or someone supposed to be her on FB and asked why she didn't warn anyone and she said she would "soon". What took her so long and why couldn't she post the warning immediately after I messaged her on FB?